Schools often have low expectations of students with disabilities, but our kids deserve a standards-aligned education just like their peers. How do we help IEP teams get on board with our vision for our kids’ potential? Education advocate Dr. Diana Fannon explains how to improve access to standards-based curriculum, how to use Core Content Connectors, what kids miss out on with alternate curriculum, how to ask for more inclusion with peers, and ways to push back against schools that want to lower the bar for kids with IEPs.
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Hi everyone. Welcome to Undivided Live. I'm Lindsay Crain and I had the content and community teams at Undivided. And for my visual description, I am a female with a short brown bob, dark frame glasses, wearing a navy button down shirt, and I'm sitting in a green office with bookcases to my right. Undivided is a digital platform and service that supports families raising neurodivergent and disabled children. Whether this is the first time you've joined us or you've hung out with us before, welcome. We're so happy that you're here. We help families navigate the complex systems that our kids rely on, like public benefits, private insurance and the educational system.
What becomes really difficult is when we start to second guess the systems that are built to support our kids, because too often it doesn't feel like they're set up to support our kids in the way they need to succeed. For example, many of our kids who receive special education services may not be at grade level. And often that becomes the reason that expectations get lowered and access starts to disappear. But that's not actually what the law or best practices dictates. So today we're talking about what standards -based IEPs really mean, why they matter for your child, no matter what placement they are in. How can the standards -based education look for a child who may be several grades behind? How can we write that into their IEP? Are alternate curriculums a positive or potentially harmful option and are the Common Core standards, or they're state equivalents really meant for all students? Spoiler alert, yes. So here to talk us through all of this and more is former special education director, education advocate and founder of Disability Ed Pro's doctor Diana Fannon. Diana is not only a parent of a child with a disability, but also a person with a disability herself.
Diana brings together her personal journey and professional expertise of over two decades working in special education. As someone who has personally worked with Diana in several different capacities, I can attest that she approaches every situation in a student centered, whole person way. She is deeply entrenched in trying to reimagine special education in ways that get our children included, educated and respected in the ways in which they deserve. Welcome, Diana. We are so happy to have you here. I am so happy to be here. Thank you so much for having me. I love this conversation. Of course. Yes. And Diana and I probably have this conversation on a on a weekly basis. So we're really excited. We're really excited to jump in. But before we do, I am sure that we have all wished that we could get a second pair of eyes on our child's IEP draft. And if that's you, it is time to check out our IEP Assistant. You can upload your child's IEP and in about five minutes it gives you personalized recommendations on where supports, accommodations, goals or services might be unclear, absent, or just not strong enough. And if you've ever wondered what your child's IEP could be missing, even if you think you have everything covered.
The IEP Assistant is for you. And importantly, the Undivided platform is HIPAA compliant because we value your child's privacy like our own. You don't have to worry about their information being shared or sold anywhere. And beyond the IEP Assistant, you can store all of your child's documents in the digital binder and ask Andy AI any other questions you might have. It can help you write emails, break down difficult processes, and help you make a step-by-step plan for public benefits or even private insurance questions. Andy is built on Undivided content, making it specifically designed for our families and informed by top experts across our community. Even better, if you need 1:1 support, you have access to a Navigator who can help you determine next steps. Our Navigators bring decades of collective lived experience in the disability community, many as parents themselves. We love our tech, but we love our people more. So you see that QR code in the corner of your screen? You can scan that link and read more about the IEP Assistant, and how it can transform the way you prep for your child's IEP So Diana, first I want to make sure that we are all talking about the same thing.
So when we talk about standards-based IEP goals, what do we mean? So standards-based goals are goals that are just that. They're based on standards. So they are targeting the skills that a child needs to access that standard. But they should still be individualized. So that's the most important thing. So they're going to be based on the grade level standards and individualized to your child's your students needs. And why? Why is it important for IEPs to be standards based? Because they are helping a child access... I'm sorry, helping a child learn the skills that they need and the skills that all of their peers are learning, and they're helping them build that bridge because everything is foundational and everything is sort of the building block, right. And, you know, we we have had so many conversations where we see kids who will get to ninth, 10th, 11th grade, having never seen a book, having never seen a full text. And we we really want And we we really want all of our children, every student to have access to all that really rich material and to all of those... all those experiences, too. It's not just... it's not just, skills.
It's an experience as well. And it helps them navigate the world around them as well. Right. Because we talk about how school is preparing them for the real world. That's part of it. And we always... We'll see a lot of these classes that talk about preparing them for life. But a lot of the skills that are being taught, that are based on the standards are part of that. Right? It's learning how to write. It's learning how to write paragraphs. It's learning how to write letters. It's learning how, you know, so a lot of those things can be done in a supported manner, but meaning supporting students who may not be at grade level and we'll talk about that as we get further on in this conversation. But so they don't have to be able to do all of the same things that their peers could do. But there's a reason the standards are what they are, and not everything is perfect about our public education system. But the skills are developed in a way that prepares our kids to have certain skills to equip them with, all the tools necessary, whether it's to go to community college, to a four year college, or simply to leave high school and go do something else.
So it could be a job. It could be, you know, becoming a content creator. It could be... But they need to have the ability to, to write, to express themselves. And if it's in writing, if it's verbally, all of those standards are there for a reason. So everything has to be... all of those goals have to be aligned with those standards. And you kind of touched on this, but, if you could maybe elaborate a little, what is the difference between a child who has access to the standards and one who doesn't? So, I think that we have... students who are not accessing those standards... Sorry, I'm looking at some notes, trying not to repeat myself, so if you see my eyes dart over, that's what it is. Because I, I tend to talk a lot and so I want to make sure that you all are getting my best information. So when a student is, connected to the grade level topics and ideas, the instruction is, it's an entirely different curriculum. So if it's standards based, then they're getting all of the sort of the state approved curriculum, usually is what happens, or it could be district approved. Right.
And so they are all... the majority of the students that are working off the same curriculum. If it is not standards based, then it's usually an entirely different curriculum. And so it is... it deprives students of that access in that rich, meaningful dialog, skill development. And it's usually... and again, it's, it can be different everywhere, but it's repetitive kind of low level skills. And often it takes on more of a life skills type focus. And, it's limited exposure to academic language and limited exposure to, what's the word I want to say, like critical skill development or, analytical reasoning. And that's really what we want our kids to learn. Again, that's sort of the building blocks, right? Our kids don't start out in kindergarten... even without disabilities, we don't start out asking them to reason. Right. That's a skill that we develop. And we see it as you move up through the grade levels. But if a student is not getting grade level curriculum or standards- based curriculum, then they may never be asked to do that. Tank you for separating that. And we're going to get into both of those, right? Because there's a way, and a lot of questions we got ahead of time or what we're going to start off with, which is, you know, how can, you know, all these diverse students, you know, be able to do this?
And that's what we're going to talk about. And there is a difference between, you know, potentially modified, I mean, there's standards based which can be modified and there's alternate curriculum. And so we are going to get further into that as well. Because a lot of children who are in separate special education classrooms, you know, do have this other option. So we're going to talk about that in a minute. Just in case we see those, questions start coming in. So Diana, what is the biggest misconception from schools about educating our kids with these standards -based education? I think the biggest misconception is that because they're not at grade level, you can't do it or it's not possible. Or that there's some sort of, like a barrier to unlock access, right? That because students are below grade level, they cannot receive standard-based curriculum or standards based... I don't remember what the question was, but yes, the standards- based education. Right. Yeah, but you have to be at a certain level in order to get that. And because students, disabilities or students with more extensive support needs are below that, you know, magical threshold that they cannot have access to it.
I think that's the biggest misconception. And I think that, when parents or educators or whomever is sort of holding those keys, and often it's not parents who hold the keys to it, but parents often don't know, maybe don't know what they don't know. Right. And so it's hard sometimes to... I was doing this, by the way, if I was off camera, I don't mean we have to fight, right? But sometimes it feels that way. But not a physical fight. But there is, you know, there's different things happening in the district side of the parent side. But, they're ... really the questions are all about what supports need to be put in place in order to make it happen. That's the question, right? So that's the biggest misconception, is they do not need to be at grade level. Because if you look at any classroom where it's full of students without IEPs, I mean, that usually doesn't happen. But let's imagine a classroom full of 30 students, none of whom have an IEP. You will never, ever find a classroom where every single student is at the same level.
And most of the time, I would imagine you'll have sort of that bell curve that we see where you'll have a chunk who's in the middle, a chunk who's at the higher end or more toward the sort of above average. And then you'll have a chunk who falls below average. So even though some students disabilities might be farther below than that, you still never have all your kids at the same level. So the perception that every student's going to be a grade level doesn't even exist as it is. The only difference is our kids are identified with a disability and we know where they are. So it gives schools sort of proof that they're below grade level. That's the only difference. So that's a huge misconception. So maybe some bias comes in when they see IEP, some unintentional, some unintentional bias, they see IEP and they think they need something different, they have this document we need to do something different. Yep. And then same question but more specifically just about IEP goals. What about standards- based IEP goals. What is the biggest misconception from districts around the goals. That they shouldn't be at grade level, I think. Then they say Yeah, that they should be closer to where the student is.
But the truth is the law says and there are, you know, there's a number of decisions that exist out there that talk about how and when I take decisions. I realize sometimes I speak too quickly, but the decisions, like court decisions, and legal precedent that talk about how the goals need to be ambitious and so ambitious means that they should be higher than where the student is so we can help push the student and have that, sort of, I don't know what I'm trying to say, but that we should be, pushing the student and hoping- having high expectations. That's what I was looking for. High expectations for the student, but that if we have a student who's a first grade reading level, that they should be... If they're in a third grade class, they should still have a third grade standard-aligned goal. They shouldn't be at a totally different grade level, right? And, and we're going to get to exactly how that can look in just a minute. I did want to talk about another, you know, huge myth. And I think I asked the majority of our education experts this question because it's far too common, so, you know, exactly what we're talking about.
A lot of parents believe or are told your child isn’t grade level, so standards don't apply, right? So how can parents respond to that when they hear that in an IEP? Your child isn't a grade level student so it doesn’t apply... Oh well, you say, “No.” But you can you can elaborate. So, it's incorrect. Right. It's kind of what we've been saying, along the way, standards should always apply, right? Because, your child is at... is a general education student first. Right. That's the most important thing. Because we're talking about access and we're talking about access to grade level curriculum. And the question, and what parents should always say is, “What supports have been tried, what has been done to allow my child access to this curriculum?” And the questioning is usually the best tactic I find, because it sort of, it usually, not always, it usually, keeps the temperature down a little bit. I can't guarantee 100% success with that.
But, you know, what has been done and what supports have been put in place and what data are you using to share this? Because again, like I said, there are a number of court decisions or court legal precedents that are out there. There's Rachel H, which talks about- has four different factors about including a child with disabilities and being at grade level is not one of them. Right. It talks about how we include students with disabilities. And there was a recent decision and it's a favorite of all of ours, it happened in Redondo Beach in 2025, where it talked about how we include students disabilities. And I won't go into it simply because we have limited time, but it really was sort of a I don't know if it was a reinterpretation, but a reapplication of that standard in being able to include students disabilities. So the standards do apply. And again, it doesn't have to be at grade level. So I would say, knowing that there are legal standards out there and asking questions about what supports have been applied, what have you done, what data are you using and yeah, that's yeah, there's there's a lot more always. But again questions I think are always the best place to start. Well and I think this is something that we can't say enough, in an IEP meeting whenever they say, “We don't do that” or, you know ‘your child is behind, but we don't teach the standards, you asked to see a copy of the policy.” Because frequently that's a cultural thing that maybe has been normalized, that they've done for a long time.
But ask for a copy of the policy. Right. Well, that's not something you do, great, I would love to see where that's written down so I can understand it. Well, one of the things I do with that too, is, I've heard that a lot and if it's policy, make sure their policy is grounded in law because policy is dangerous too, right? Because policy might be a district practice, which may not be a good practice. So, you may be able to get some good information about a practice that the district has had for a long time that might not be good. So that's a really good point. Yeah. There looks like there is a comment from Mia, which is a really good segue because I want to talk about Common Core Connectors. And in some states I know it's called- they use dynamic learning maps, or maybe they have a state equivalent, but we're going to talk about Common Core Connectors, which, you know, we're going to get into that one second, but Mia, Mia just said, “I feel like the IEP goals are dumbed down for lack of a better term, to make them more easily achievable rather than pushing kids to get at grade level.”
Mia, you are exactly right. That is exactly why we're talking about this today. Because instead of having challenging standards aligned goals, they're looking for something maybe because it's easily achievable. Maybe they're looking for it because that's what they've always done. And that's exactly what this conversation today is about. Diana, did you want to add anything to Mia’s comment? Yeah, well, I think that’s... It happens all the time. So, I think, so Mia, you're 100% right. It happens all the time. And I think we can sort of... I mean, I don't have anything to add to that. Mia. I'm sorry. I'm sorry that's happening because it does. It happens on a regular basis. And I was in an IEP meeting not long ago where that was happening. And there was a little bit of a battle even to get the standards aligned to grade level or to find grade level standards, you know, that were aligned, because they were, you know, they were using an old- the previous grade level where the child was transitioning into the next grade level. So it is happening and I think that we are going to talk about Common Core Connectors, and that is a helpful way.
Some districts either don't use them or don't know about them and I'm not sure which it is, but you know, and I've honestly, I do think it is sometimes internalized, like implicit bias or ableism because I have heard people say, “I'm worried about her. She's too fragile.” I've heard some things that are really... unsettling, because, again, students may have medical diagnoses or they may have other challenges, but it doesn't change the fact that they're still a student in your class. So I don't know if you want to, Let's go on maybe to the next. Well, yeah, why don't you explain for those who don't know what core content connectors are, Diana, if you could explain... And they are used in the majority of states. Like I said, dynamic learning maps I know for some other states and I think there might be some states that also have their own state equivalent. But if you could explain what those are and why do you need to know about them? So basically they are, I think last I checked it was like 41 of the states, I don't know if we're still at that many, because I think we were talking about this the other day, I don't know how many, but there's... the states that use, the Common Core standards, most of them use the core connectors, but not all.
And so it's, it's an ever evolving, you know, it's ever evolving, so what our states are using and what our education system is doing, but they’re sort of reduced complexity versions, but then they also have reduced, elements basically of each of the standards. So they basically take, the most important parts of each of the standards to make sure that students with extensive support needs still can master those essential elements of each standard. And so they maintain alignment to the grade level, content. So, it's really important for parents because it can help you understand and help you remind your school ever so gently, what grade level content can look like. So, you know, it can be like, helping to figure out what kind of support can be provided in order to get your child to grade level content. And it prevents schools from saying, “No, no, no, they can't do this” or “we're not going to do this.” I mean, they shouldn't be saying that anyway, because that's illegal, but it can help you map out, you know, I've seen this, I know this is here. I know this is possible. Have you used this? Right. It helps you frame questions and it can help parents be a stronger, more... more informed advocate.
So it's a roadmap for schools and it's information for parents. Yeah. And it can also be a roadmap for parents. I mean, because if you're thinking, and we're going to get into how this can look, but if you're reading the Common Core State Standards thinking, okay, so they're in seventh grade, this is all about reading and my child can't read yet. How in the world am I going to align to this? But when you look at the core connector, it might say, you know, or the essential understanding, I mean, that's how it's laid out in our state right into these three categories where it's like, you know, “Can identify what the story is about,” right? The main theme of the story. And that doesn't mean that you're writing an eight page essay, which maybe some of the other kids in the class are, but that might be, you know, on, you know, an assistive technology device for them, you know, being able to pick exactly what that story is about, or to sit in a group and to be able to talk about what they just read and our kids can still even if they're having, one sentence, that is equivalent to one chapter, they can have their AAC device read that to them.
There's a million different ways our kids can access the... access the curriculum and access the standards. And looking at those core connectors, it breaks it down. So it's not, even as a parent, it's not so overwhelming thinking, well, how can my child do this? And then you're looking at what's really behind it and under it and the underlying skill. And it all of a sudden it opens things up. It seems attainable. Like, okay, this is something that we can do. We can actually really open up conversations with your team. And it helps to identified sort of like what Lindsay was just saying kind of identifies those entry points. And then we talk so much about and we won't get into that in this conversation, but it really helps when... we talk so much about universal design for learning now, which is how to prepare lessons for multiple different levels in a classroom. And or we've talked about differentiating. It's very similar. And the only difference really is that universal design for learning, you prepare the lesson ahead of time with different levels in mind. And so it really allows teachers to then know, right, that you're going to have a student who will be, you know, who will maybe share their lesson verbally, right?
Or they'll share their learnings verbally or they’ll share their lesson through their device. Right. So there's a number of different ways to share learning or to participate in an activity. And so it's perfect for that because it really gives, even for teachers, you know, for all of us to understand, oh, this is what it's trying to teach us because some of the standards are I mean, I know... I know they're there for a reason, but if you look at them, you're like, what is... what's going on here? So they're really like, what lies beneath, really, is what it is. It's not a scary movie, but it is really helpful. Sometimes it can be a scary movie Diana... It can be a scary movie every day for, for more reasons. But I also wanted to point out there used to be, all of the national core connectors were on a site. It was actually taken down, but we had records of them. And there is one more site that still has all of the collective learnings of that. And it doesn't mean that they're not still valid. It was an accessibility issue. But we have actually organized all of the core connectors by grade based on all of those original postings. And so I think Brittany is sharing that link in the chat.
So open it up, take a look. And you know and you'll if you've never looked at them before, you'll start really understanding how that can bring possibilities into the conversation and into the IEP conversation. And another important point, Diana, I think, is I really want to clarify, to be clear, can a student be in GenEd with a modified curriculum? And I mentioned that because again, that's doing, if you have a child, maybe with an intellectual disability or more extensive support needs, and they need their work modified to be able to get those, you know, to be able to have standards aligned goals. But can a student be in GenEd if they have a modified curriculum? Yes, 100%. The only pushback you're ever going to get is from adults. So, it's a staffing problem. It's an adult problem. It's not a child problem. Right. That's the pushback we always get is how... how the system supports it. So that's always the issue you're going to face. I've seen a number of students have really good success with that, but the amount of work to get there is, again, it's teacher and related service provider and principal and assistant principal and assistant superintendent and superintendent. That is always the... you know, there lies the rub.
That is the challenge. And that continues to be the challenge everywhere. But I will also say, and if you hear that from teams too, it is a lot of work upfront. Right. But if you're doing it right, what you're doing for one student, you might have several different versions and that's going to be able to help multiple students. I actually had a conversation with a teacher who was very unsure of his agenda, you know, it was a special ed teacher who had done this for a long time but had never actually modified for GenEd for students with extensive support needs. And it was a struggle, and there were a lot of people working to support her. And then it clicked and she, you know, and she admitted, like, it was intimidating at first. It was a lot of work. But then I started using this for all these other students I was supporting. And then, you know, that got tweaked. And then you have sort of this like, here's my five different versions of this unit, right? Or these four different versions or whatever. And then you're going to be able to use that and obviously tweak that as needed. But for other students so is work up front. But something that will be invaluable that you're going to be able to continue growing and tweaking, but that you're going to be able to use for more students. Yeah. And I said that, by the way, not because that should be a reason, but that the pushback isn't on the kids.
Right? The kids have every legal right to be there. And nine times out of ten, as long as you can get- they will have a good experience as long as you can get the adults to buy in, they can still be there without the adult buy in, it just may be a bumpier road. And with our AI and all of that, the modification of work or the accommodations, it's so much easier these days. So it's just getting the adults to get on board. Right. And on that, right, I think it's really important that we talk about how the core connectors, how can they help us shape IEP goals. And if an IEP team has never done this right, like how can parents really present this and how can they really help determine. Because I know for a lot of staff members, they're like, I don't even know where to start with IEP goals or maybe they're recycling the same things that they use for a lot of other kids. And parents are like, I don't know what else I should be asking for, and this can be such an important framework, so how can we use it? Well, you can figure out the core skill, like what are we really looking at in this goal?
Like what is the thing that we're trying to teach, right. Instead of asking a child to write a six paragraph essay, what is the thing that you're trying to get them to do? Because you you have a child who can't write... what is, like, maybe they have a physical disability. You're going to have to change that goal. And I saw a goal that somebody else wrote where they expressed their thoughts instead of writing, and because they figured out that the whole thing was idea generation, and it was brilliant. And everyone at the table was pushing back against it, and I even did initially, too, because I was like, huh... But the underlying goal, it wasn't like the student was working on the task, like different things in other areas, but the student doesn't have the ability to write five paragraphs, so it doesn't matter if you change it to one paragraph or one sentence, it's never going to happen. So they had to change it and they had to shift their mindset. And it ended up... I don't remember what they called the goal, they called it something else, but it was idea generation. And the teacher was really- I was really impressed, honestly.
You know, out of all the things that came out of the meeting, that was something that I thought was really cool because that was what it was. So it's really using- and those core connectors can help you, can do some of that work for you. You don't have to sit there and labor over these standards and think, okay, what does that mean? What is the standard? What are we trying to figure out here? What is my child going to learn? What would they be doing if they were in that class? What can be? Because then you really have to be a teacher yourself or be some like a high level curriculum designer to figure out what were they trying to teach kids with this and what would be the building block of that standard? Right. Like, that's really what it is. Yeah. And it's that skill beneath the standard... which is really important. Right. Because it might be really specific, but you don't want one specific standard as an IEP goal. Right. You want that skill that's going to be able to be used all across day in many different situations. Yeah.
And I, you know, we're talking about modifying obviously for GenEd, but how about students in a special ed classroom. Is there any reason that they shouldn't also have standards aligned goals using the core connectors? No no no no no no no no. Everyone should have standards aligned curriculum, standards aligned goals always, because that's, I mean, that's what we're supposed to be doing here. We're supposed to be teaching our kids. Those standards were developed for a reason. I mean, do I always think they're perfect? No, but for now they're what we have. And so that's what everyone should be learning. Right. No matter your placement. Yes. Exactly. What is the risk to a child when goals are not aligned to grade level standards. So I think there... we're looking at... some of the things we spoke about before, which I think is- and it's over time and the future and the exposure. Right. So over time, like one year So over time, like one year maybe it's not going to be the end of the world. But the problem is what we see happen is that if a student is in a separate classroom, right when they're in a special ed classroom, or if they're not getting or even if they're in GenEd, but they're getting separate goals, right?
And so they're teaching to the IEP, which is what we hear a lot. Right. Oh well I'm using the IEP goals to drive my instruction. Okay. Well it should be part of what you're doing. But it shouldn't be the whole thing. So we have a child who gets only instruction or only non standards- based instruction. And a lot of kids will have IEPs for 13, 14, 15 years. Yeah. From 3 to 18. Or, no I'm saying IEPs. For their entire education. Yes, the entirety of their education. And it could be from 3 to 18, or it could be from 3 to 22. And so we're talking that you have that whole time where you're missing out every year. And so again one year okay, maybe, maybe that will be a big deal. Two years, maybe that won't be a big deal. But then you look at the entirety of your education where every little bit of missed time with that exposure compounds. Right. And so the thing about education, as many of us know, is that it is not- I use the word compound intentionally. Right. Because it's like interest, right. Think about interest on a loan or something or interest on, you know, when you have to pay somebody back, it doesn't just add up.
It's not like two plus two plus two plus two. It's more like two times two and then four times two and then. Right. I mean, and then I'm doing very basic here, just so it's easier for me to do off the cuff. But it's astronomical because it builds and it multiplies in every year of missed exposure builds on another year of missed exposure, builds on another- Sorry, I'm going to tear up because this is the weight that I feel when I'm working with kids, and I'm working with districts because we are depriving them of something that they have a legal right to and that they are entitled to. So we're talking about exposure to books, to reading, to current events, to history, to, I mean, some of that's being taken out of schools anyway. So, but again, what they could be exposed to. Sorry, I don't mean to go there, but we are exposing them to all kinds of learnings and teachings and conversations and math and learning how to balance a checkbook and to, you know, to- if they want to be an architect and design buildings and just think, I think about all the things that are happening in classrooms and conversations and then we talk about a diploma. We haven’t even gotten to that yet, right?
So all of those things and every year build on the next and we take it away and we make decisions so cavalierly, and then we limit their future opportunities because somebody somewhere decided that they weren't worth having a standards- based curriculum. Right. They weren't worth the time or the effort. It's true, it's true. And we know way too many families who really, you know, at younger ages, it, you know, it's like, okay, well we're working on those skills. It's okay. You know, and you're you're trusting it. And you and I both know a lot of families where all of a sudden their kid hits middle school and you realize that they've never read a book, they haven't ever had a curriculum that has a beginning, middle and end, that they're sitting and doing skills all day. And that is not the purpose of school. You can work on all of those skills in the midst of actually having a curriculum. It shouldn't be normal that our children don't go to, you know, don't learn science and social studies, right? That they're just sitting doing like drills all day, which is, you know, or nothing. Right.
Or they're sitting on a computer because it's adaptive or they're sitting on a computer doing an app. They're doing an app, right. That’s, you know, supposedly broken things down. So we have to really have these conversations because you get used to how things are and things are normalized. And even, you know, parents can really normalize those things too, especially if that's all you see. Yeah. And so I do really want to talk about the “how.” And so let's talk about how it can actually look to align a goal to grade level standards if a child is far below grade level. How do you write a standards-aligned IEP goal for a sixth grader who is reading at a first grade level? So I... I made some notes on this to make sure that I was kind of prepared and we would do something like, you know, given a supported- like, if we're looking at analyzing text and something like, “Given the supported text, audio or visuals, the student will identify the main idea from choices.” And the key idea would be the same thinking scale but a different entry point.
And you could- So the conceptual focus is analyzing a text to determine the central idea and how it's supported by details. And we can go into more detail with the goal and say, you know, “By a given date, given a grade level text adapted with supports the student will identify the main idea from 3 to 4 options and select at least one supporting detail with 80% accuracy.” And I love the way our goals are written. But again, the idea is that it's a supported text, so you can have audio or visuals, and then we're still looking at main idea from choices, but it's all about analyzing text. That would be the standard, right. That's a sixth grade standard. But it is the same skill and it's a different entry point. And so how can that look? So bring that to life for us. So how can that students day look in class? How do we make that work? Because it's one thing to have the IEP goal, and so then how does somebody who is in a sixth grade GenEd ELA class, english language arts, and they're reading at a first grade level and they have this goal for analyzing text, so then how can that look. So they're going to have the same topic as their peers. They're going to have the same types of the subject matter.
And like I mentioned, they may even have... their teacher might have taken that subject material and put it through, you know, Claude or Gemini and popped in that material to make it at a slightly easier reading level. Or they might have, I'm spacing on the name, but there are some really great read aloud text, you can even use, your Google Chrome with it. There's like... what is it called? These little things that read aloud for you now. Well, there's a lot of Google Chrome extensions and, Brittany, I don't know if you have this if you could, if you could drop that into the link, but there's Read & Write, is that what you were thinking? Yeah. Yes. Yeah. So there's so many great ways for read aloud if a student has their own device. I mean, there's so many different ways for the read aloud to happen, but so, they would have that, a material that was at their reading level and have, like I said, modified materials. So they can read it. That would be one way for it to be modified visually, and then they could listen to it as well. And then we talk about chunking a lot. Whether chunking works for some kids.
And that's just, you know, being able to have it in shorter text, right, being able to have it- And that can reduce visual clutter for some students because seeing it all on a page can be overwhelming. It is for me, honestly, but for our students with- if there's visual processing... If there's a visual processing disorder, then that can help them to see better. But then there can also be support through like a paraprofessional and then some pre teaching and reteaching. So during the day that's how it might look, like they may be doing... a different assignment at the same time and it would be the same subject matter. It would just be reduced in maybe length, complexity, and they may have support from assistive technology, and AI, perhaps to reduce or to read it aloud to them, and then there could also be a paraprofessional to assist with, again, attention or just time on task, things like that, depending on the student. Right. So there's all kinds of different ways to support a student in a GenEd classroom being able to read and access that goal, which would be text analysis. Right.
So in that case that would be the reading component of it. So it's the same classroom. They would just have different supports. And that's really the trick, which is a lot of times you'll hear about barriers, but what we need to be hearing instead are supports. And that's really what it's about. Absolutely. And it's about, you know, my daughter has, you know, she has an IEP, she has extensive support needs and she was in special ed classes through elementary, of which they were not reading books. And so when we got to middle school and we, you know, dove in way more for inclusion, And I mean, I've given this example before, but they were reading The Outsiders. So we watched the movie. She had a modified version of the book, and guess what she got to do? When they go to lunch and everyone's talking about The Outsiders or when they're in their small group discussions talking about it, so she didn't read every single word, but her modified text and the work that they were doing hit on the main points of the book so she could be in those conversations. They're all sitting there talking about it. She was very traumatized when Johnny got burned. So she can have those conversations.
And, you know, she was part of that. She's a part of what everyone else in her entire grade is experiencing instead of sitting, reading first grade sentences about ducks, you know, that she has done, you know, for seven years. It makes such a difference. Exactly. And then there's a lot of social elements that come into that as well. Yeah. And we have a really good question, both Nikki and Tanya were wondering essentially, should you have a goal in every Common Core state, standard area, or should you be picking 1 or 2? And Tanya said, yes, that's what I was wanting to know. If not, how do you pick which ones? So, I heard this the other day as well. Somebody mentioned having a goal in every standard. I don't know... No way that you could! I don't think that would be manageable. No. And I think that usually the way we look at standards or the way we look at goals, rather I should say, is it's unique to your child, right? Every child is going to be different. Like, your child may be doing really well in certain areas and not as well in other areas. And that's how you would want to choose the goals for your child.
Even though you may have a child who is below grade level ability wise in all areas, right? And so you may think, oh my gosh, I have to have a goal in every area. But I would never recommend that because one, it's not attainable, right? You can't, nobody can. I couldn't, Lindsay couldn’t. None of us could achieve all the goals that you set in a year, because it also distills the resources. Even the best school is not going to be able to work on 15, 20, 25, 30 goals. I mean, if you have multiple providers working on them, you might. But let's say you're talking about, you know, ten standards or ten areas in english, reading, writing... and there's another area of english language arts that I'm spacing on... but if you have ten just in english language arts, there's likely only going to be one provider working on those goals. And so as much as I'd like to say, even our best teachers, that would be a lot for them to work on. And it's a lot for a child to work on just in one area. So, I would say that, what is the biggest need in the area and what's going to serve the most sort of bang for your buck, right?
Like if you... maybe there's three in that area, if you're in third or fourth grade, you're going to want to talk about reading, right? That's the time when you want to make sure that you got sort of the foundational building blocks of reading, or sort of like the learning to read, right, depending on where your child is, because they may not figure it all out at that point if they have more extensive support needs or more significant disabilities at that time, but you still want to work on it, right? You still want to work on, concepts of print, you know, all all of that stuff. That's really where it comes down at that time. So that's what I would sort of spend my time and energy on. I don't know, Lindsay. What do you think? Well, yeah, I was thinking, because it's overwhelming. It's like, where do we start? But I think for me, I was thinking, and I'm not an advocate, so, correct me if I’m wrong. But you're a parent! But, you know, it's comprehension was the third, right, of reading. And so, you know, nobody was pointing that out and I was just getting sight word goals, right? When my daughter was young, and so when you look at the three categories of reading, if they're assessments are showing that they have need in all of the different areas, right.
Decoding, comprehension, and what was the third? Now I'm forgetting. Well whatever the three foundational, you know, which obviously I need to brush up on, of ELA. All of those state standards, those are all things that if they're in a standards aligned classroom, they're going to be learning those anyway. Yeah. So you pick the skills that the assessments are showing that they need and it's a skill under the standard, you're focusing on those skills while their accommodations or making sure that whatever standards they're working on in the class, that they're accessible to them. Exactly. You don't need a goal for every single standard that they're going to be working on in class. But what are the skills that you want to target that are going to then cover, you know, a majority of those standards, what are those skills? And so I know that gets a little bit into the weeds, but that is what you should be working on- looking at those standards what are the skills that you're identifying, and then those should be skills that you're working on across all the standards. So you don't get a goal for every standard you're looking at what are the skills we're targeting and how can that be, you know, amplified throughout their entire day.
Yeah. But that's why, again, that's why we like... that's why I'm a huge proponent of general ed placement for students because with an additional focus like support, then students who are in the general classroom will have exposure to all of those standards and all of the things every other student gets. And then an additional, you know, whatever they're getting a day through resource or through whatever else they're getting in the way of instruction, will be getting that focus time on those additional goals. Right. And if an IEP team pushes back and says that that level of support is not possible in GenEd and therefore the student has to be in a separate SpEd class, what can a parent say? You can say, well, I would say, you know, “Explain to me what supports were considered, what supports can you provide in GenEd?” And so I think it depends where you're coming from too. Are you in the special ed classroom and going to GenEd or the other way around? Right. So but again, same thing in two different directions. So you know, what supports were considered before changing placement or before rejecting my my request?
How can we increase support rather than remove access? And how does this align with the least restrictive environment? Right. Because that's really what the law says, right? The students should be educated with their- it says non disabled peers, but with their peers without disabilities- to the maximum extent possible. And so I think those are sort of the biggest questions to ask. But again it depends on if you're in GenEd or if you're in a special day class and you want to move. And Christy had a follow up because I know assessments came up. She was asking about, she said that their state is really pushing for alternate assessments for kids with certain eligibility categories, which prevents them from earning a traditional high school diploma. So if parents refuse to provide consent for these alternate assessments, they are saying the kids have to be taught at grade level standards without modifications. So how can we combat this? Oh, that's... Would that again be- I think I would again say let me see the policy. Yeah. Is that in your state Ed code Christy?
Yeah. I would be interested to see more about that because that seems... without knowing more information and not without knowing about like, the state, I would want to know more about where that comes from, if there is legal precedent for that. If there is not legal precedent, then I would say no, but there would be more than that, right? I would never say never say “no” right? That's never the answer. But like sort of umbrella is “no”, but there would be a lot more nuance to that, which is a lot of districts like to say that there has to be sort of proof or that a child has to earn something, but the law, federal law says that's not true. Right. And there's a lot of legal precedent to support that. So what Christy just posted without again, without more nuance or with the questions she just asked is not again, with no more information, it does not seem legal, but I would hope that there's a little bit more to it that we don't know about. Although I don't, I don't know because you should be able to get modifications and accommodations in a general education classroom without having to take these alternate assessments.
So again, I would need a little more information to be able to speak to it. And ask for the policy, Christy. And if it still wasn't making sense, it might be, you know, you might want to consult with an advocate or an attorney. Because that sounds like it's a policy that isn't actually a policy. Right. We all hear, “This is our policy,” but can I see where that's written down? I mean, I called school board members, am I missing this policy somewhere? Right. Chances are it might not actually be a policy. And if it is a policy like Diana mentioned before, it might not be a valid policy. And so we've been talking a lot about modified curriculum, you know, as in modifying the work, keeping it aligned to the standards. But I also want to talk about out of the box curriculum, often called alternate curriculum. And I think some questions came through about this as well, because many kids, especially those in separate special ed classrooms, are put frequently on an alternate curriculum, which is supposedly designed for students with extensive support needs or intellectual disability. So the idea behind using an alternate curriculum instead of modifying for the state standards is what?
Is this to make it easier for certain students to learn, or is it supposed to be a tool for teachers, students or both? So my instinct, and I have a little bit of a bias I'll be honest, I don't love the packaged alternative curriculums. They are... I believe they're designed to make it easier for teachers to teach. Now, it's not always a bad thing, because sometimes it means that there is a clear sort of sequence and instruction and, and some delivery of material going on. Right. So sometimes that is a good thing. My resistance to it is that it is not- It's a lot of the things that we've already talked about, which it doesn't include- it is standards aligned in the farthest of ways. Right. It will pick out some standards and it will say that it's tied to this or tied to that, but it's not aligned in the way that we're talking about. Right. It's like very loosely correlated with some of the standards usually. And it depends on which package curriculum you're talking about.
But it is not... it can often become sort of a limit to what our students are allowed to do. Like, it doesn't push. It's not what we're talking about, ambitious, we're talking about raising expectations. It won't do that. Or at least none that I've seen have ever done that. And it is not what you've been talking about, Lindsay, like what your daughter was doing and able to talk with her peers. It is not the same thing that the GenEd peers are doing. It doesn't have any of those components of, sort of real world, like books and learning and socialization. It doesn't have the same things that we're talking about. So, no, I think they’re more tools for teachers than for students. And can parents, and how can parents push back if an alternate curriculum is being offered for their kids? So, I would... Similar questions that we sort of talked about, which is, is this core curriculum? Talk to me about the standards alignment. Is this the same thing that the students in GenEd are learning? Keep asking questions, keep digging in, and how does it connect to grade level instruction?
If they were to go into another same grade classroom, what would they be learning? And, ask for what the alignment evidence is and talk about their access. Right. Because that's really what it is, it’s all about access. Those are always going to be the areas of focus. And the other thing is too the standards- based curriculum is always approved. So is this one approved? I've never seen the same approval process required for an alternate curriculum that I have for the books, the textbooks, all of that. They have to approve the contract, the spending. But I've never seen a board go through the same approval process as they do for textbooks. Everybody votes on textbooks. They put all these books out, everyone reads them. There's committees for new curriculum. I’ve never seen the same thing happen for an alternate curriculum. It's really good. It's a really good point. And also, can you ask, you know, I mean, if they haven't tried all of the supports, right, if they haven't tried modifications, I mean, you can try that to show that before we jump to this, let's try. We want to be aligned and let's try that before we go there? Does that work in the same way?
Yeah, I mean it should, again you get pushback because I think sometimes, you will get pushback and it doesn't mean you shouldn't try it. You should always... it feels to me while it technically would be on the same level, it feels to me like an all curriculum feels more restrictive. Right. So what I would suggest and what I would like to see, if people still want to use the prepackaged alt curriculum, it should be a supplement, not the only thing. So they should have the regular GenEd curriculum, they should have the textbooks, they should have all the same things that are in another classroom. And that should be used to supplement for maybe, like, almost like intensive support or small groups or whatever it is. Right. And we have a question from Diana for Diana. But she said for her state, I have been told that a-g curriculum can not be modified and allow for students to earn... Sorry, let me read that again. I've been told that a-g curriculum can not be modified and allow for students to earn a-g credit. Can a-g be modified to earn GenEd credit? Yes.
So what you're talking about, Diana, is a policy, not a law. So a-g credit, it's going to be... so a-g for people who are not in California, we're talking about the UC's and the CSU's. So it's not regular, like other colleges will have different rules, but the Cal State, all of those colleges and then UC’s, that's the a-g that we're talking about. And they have very specific requirements. And the modifications are different, but you can get specific- every high school then has specific requirements in order to get credits for college readiness. But when it's standards based, the modifications and all of that comes with different requirements. So, there is a lot of different things as it goes with that. But standards- based curriculum can be modified to get college credit when it comes to the a-g’s, it should still be able to, as long as it's standards based. And modified to a... is there a line there? I mean, because it can't be modified too much to get traditional diploma. Maybe that wasn't the question. So I don't know. Maybe we have to go back and talk offline about that.
But yeah, as long as you're staying on diploma track and you're not on alternative assessment, there's certain caveats to all of that. So yeah, it gets a little complicated. It does get complicated. But there absolutely are ways. Yeah. Diana, are there any circumstances when it does not make sense for a student to have strength-based goals, or sorry, to have standards -based goals or strength -based goals, but standards-based goals. No, I don't think so. For standards-based goals, I cannot think of a time when I would not recommend having a standards -based goal. Okay. I'm looking at the time and I’m trying to... Well, and I mean, we have so many questions here that... there's just, there's so many good questions that it's already 1:00 that we're not going to be able to get to. You know, if Diana has time, you know, maybe she can go back and look at some of the questions in the chat, maybe, you know, weigh in if she has time. And we can definitely share resources for some of these as well. But I did want to just at least ask one more question to kind of just bring this visual to life because it is hard for parents when they're surrounded by teams saying, “This isn't possible. This isn't what we do. We haven't done it.”
So if we walked into a classroom tomorrow and you know, everything we've been talking about was actually done right, and all students of varying abilities were receiving a standards-based education, what might feel different for a parent looking at that class than maybe observing their child in a non-standards- aligned-based classroom? So I think that the student would feel like they were part of a class. They'd feel like they were with their peers, that they were supported, that they were really being prepared for the next step in life. That's a little bit the parent too. But they... it's a little bit like we're talking about standards, but it also... it sort of conflates with inclusion a little bit too. And so, because it's a student who kind of really belongs in the classroom because that's what the child feels and that's what's been reported to me, is that when the supports are given, when the changes are made, when it's sort of done right, the child knows it, right. A student knows it from- I mean, it starts as young as, you know, 3, 4 or 5 years old, all the way up to high school. Kids know when they're wanted, they know when they're being intentionally supported.
And so there is... kids behave differently and they learn differently, and they participate differently because they are part of the group and they are wanted. And so it really looks very different. And so for the parent, I think that, you know, I, I was explaining this to somebody the other day, it's like you send your child to school for you know, anywhere between 6 and 8 hours and you leave them there and depending on the extent of their disability and how able they are to communicate with you, you have to trust that the school's going to take care of them. And so the more in alignment all of this is, the more confidence you have in the school and the teacher in the classroom. So it really is it's... we're talking about, you know, standards -based instruction, but really it's about somebody who cares enough about you and your child and your family and all of the children to really push and aim for higher goals and to set those expectations because they believe that your child is worth it. And that feels different for everybody.
So it's standards based, but it's inclusion and it's hope and it's I mean, there's so much that's wrapped up into it that it's more than just standards, right? It's rightful presence. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Thank you Diana. I mean I know we could go on and on and I do see so many good questions. And I'm so sorry we didn't have time to get to as many as possible. So thank you, Diana, for really digging into why and, you know, just barely scratching the surface, but how every student can and should be getting a standards -based education. So just, you know, on repeat because we can't say it enough times. Placements should not dictate their access nor learning levels nor diagnosis. Core connectors, the content connectors, the dynamic learning maps, they all break down skills so they can meet your child where they are, right. They give us that framework so we don't have to guess what our child should be learning. And this is not a new concept, right? Modifications aren't a favor. They are part of access to LRE and an essential tool for students who require that level of support. They exist precisely so any student can access the standards.
So just because your school or district hasn’t actively modified work for students in general education before, that doesn't mean it shouldn't or that it can't happen. And if they're in a special education classroom, that does not preclude them from receiving a standards -aligned education. So again, if you're told, well, this is how it is and that's not what you want for your child, ask for a copy of that policy, ask for a change of placement, reach out for help if you need it. But you don't have to accept that what they have normalized is what is right for your child. So this is how we move from hoping... this is how we move from hoping how things work to knowing what to ask for and how to advocate for it. And that shift matters for your child and for every family coming after you.
So thank you again to Diana for talking with us today and to all of you for being here. Our mission is to support you so your children can thrive, and we want you to thrive too. We'll see you soon.
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